Hannah Chaplin, da Receptive

Episódio 008 do Founder Coffee

Sou Jeroen, da Salesflare, e este é o Founder Coffee.

A cada duas semanas, tomo caf√© com um fundador diferente. Conversamos sobre a vida, as paix√Ķes, os aprendizados... em uma conversa √≠ntima, conhecendo a pessoa por tr√°s da empresa.

Para este oitavo epis√≥dio, conversei com Hannah Chaplin, cofundadora do Receptive, o software que simplifica o gerenciamento de produtos. Hannah come√ßou a trabalhar como recepcionista em uma empresa de software, depois fundou uma ag√™ncia de desenvolvimento e, desde ent√£o, tem v√°rias empresas de SaaS e com√©rcio eletr√īnico.

Conversamos sobre empresas de SaaS brilhantes, a import√Ęncia do feedback e do aprendizado do usu√°rio, as virtudes do GDPR e sobre como chegamos onde estamos agora.

Bem-vindo ao Founder Coffee.


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Jeroen: Olá, Hannah, é um prazer tê-la no Founder Coffee.

Hannah: Thank you. I’ve actually got a cup of coffee. So we’re doing this right, aren’t we?

Jeroen: Sim, eu também, do meu lado.

Hannah: Perfeito.

Jeroen: It’s almost finished but maybe we can stop half way and I’ll get another one.

Hannah: Sim, voc√™ poderia colocar um pouco de m√ļsica no meio do caminho? Para que as pessoas possam ouvi-la enquanto preparamos um drinque?

Jeroen: Well, don’t tell the people, but I edit it.

Hannah: Secret’s out.

Jeroen: You are the Founder of Receptive. There are a lot of people in our network who are not in SaaS, don’t know about the awesome tools to manage products or make their product management more efficient. For those who don’t know about Receptive, what does the product do?

Hannah: If you want to be super precise, we’re specifically for B2B SaaS companies. Product feedback is a huge problem, so we’ve got a system that helps these companies collect the feedback from customers, their internal teams and the market. The tool offers lots of reporting and analytics, that can help them understand all the data and make sure everybody is working on things that really count — product wise. We help them when they start to scale or reach an enterprise level.

Jeroen: Então, basicamente, você recebe feedback, organiza-o, conecta-o aos recursos e prioriza o roteiro futuro. Isso está correto?

Hannah: Yeah, exactly. So all the feedback’s highly prioritized. We’ve got a really nice dashboard that offers a lovely customer experience. They can basically go in at any time and see how things are looking for their product and change the priorities. People need to change product roadmaps all the time!

Nós nos certificamos de que as pessoas sejam mantidas atualizadas e entendam em que ponto estão as coisas, e os relatórios são tudo isso. Com um clique, você pode ver o que os clientes corporativos na Alemanha querem em comparação com os usuários de avaliação gratuita. Por exemplo, você pode ver dados muito bem divididos para ajudar a decidir o que será incluído no roteiro do seu produto.

Jeroen: E você está de alguma forma conectado a outras ferramentas?

Hannah: Yeah, we’ve got a few integrations actually.

Obviously a lot of the feedback process runs through systems like Salesforce, and Zendesk. So we’ve connected with tools that customer facing teams use to receive feedback on feature requests.

Por outro lado, também nos integramos a ferramentas como o JIRA. Portanto, no Receptive, se você concordar em prosseguir com a criação de um dos recursos sugeridos por um feedback, ele criará automaticamente a tarefa para a equipe de desenvolvimento.

Isso também funciona de forma inversa. Portanto, o Receptive está sempre atualizado!

Jeroen: Based on the tools you mentioned, it’s more aimed at bigger companies I guess?

Hannah: Sem d√ļvida.

I think when you’re smaller, you can get away with a spreadsheet or just getting your feedback on Trello. That’s what even we used before Receptive days.

But at one point, you have a lot of feedback coming in to all the different teams. For example, your sales teams will have hundreds of discussions every day and some feedback would definitely come out of it. It’s really a scale that feedback is a huge problem. But if you do it right, it’s a massive opportunity. It’s just getting those processes right and in place.

Jeroen: Sim. Você disse que estava organizando algumas coisas no Trello antes, isso foi em outra empresa?

Hannah: Yes. So this is actually the fourth business I’ve had and the second SaaS company. I actually started off as a project manager. So we used Basecamp, Trello and a few other tools like them.

Jeroen: Você pode nos contar sobre as diferentes startups que teve?

Hannah: Sure. I won’t make it too long, don’t worry.

Jeroen: Oh, n√£o, v√° em frente!

Hannah: The first one I started was when I was 21. I’d left school and got a job on the reception desk of a software company, and then I got really fascinated by it all and got into it completely.

Então, criei uma agência de desenvolvimento e costumávamos reunir equipes técnicas e trabalhar com grandes agências de branding em Londres. Desenvolvíamos e implementávamos a parte técnica de seus projetos.

Depois, tivemos uma empresa de sistema de controle de estoque, que era como um produto SaaS. Foi da√≠ que surgiram muitas das ideias para o Receptive. Entre essas duas coisas, eu estava trabalhando muito com com√©rcio eletr√īnico. Dirigia uma empresa de desenvolvimento de com√©rcio eletr√īnico que operava grandes plataformas Gentoo.

Na verdade, uma grande variedade de coisas. Mas tudo é software!

Jeroen: Tudo relacionado a software, certo.

Hannah: Sim.

Jeroen: Se você estava envolvido com esse tipo de coisa, por que começou como recepcionista?

Hannah: I don’t know. I just literally left school and was like, “I need a job.”

Jeroen: O que você estudou?

Hannah: Na escola? Todos os tipos.

Eu gostava de m√ļsica, economia, pol√≠tica, estudos de neg√≥cios e tamb√©m de esportes. Portanto, eu n√£o tinha ideia do que queria fazer naquele momento. Voc√™ sabia que queria criar uma empresa?

Jeroen: Mais ou menos, sim. Na verdade, eu sabia que me tornaria engenheiro quando tinha mais ou menos 10 anos de idade, eu acho.

Hannah: Sério?

Jeroen: Sim, e isso se deve ao fato de meus pais, especialmente meu pai. Ele era um engenheiro de mão cheia, sempre liderou departamentos de P&D. Então, eu sabia que seria engenheiro e, de alguma forma, também sabia que queria ter minha própria empresa.

Desde os meus 15 anos, mais ou menos, comecei a criar sites e j√° sonhava em ter minha pr√≥pria ag√™ncia da Web. Nunca houve qualquer d√ļvida quanto a isso. Sempre odiei a ideia de trabalhar em uma grande empresa. Na verdade, eu trabalhei!

Hannah: Você fez isso?

Jeroen: Sim.

Hannah: Como foi isso? Foi horrível?

Jeroen: Oh, foi muito ruim. Trabalhei nisso por 10 meses, mas odiei desde o início. Tive outro emprego depois de oito meses e saí dele também depois de dez meses. Na verdade, comecei na Baxter, se você conhece essa empresa.

Hannah: Não. Então, essa foi uma empresa que você abriu depois de trabalhar 10 meses em uma grande organização?

Jeroen: N√£o. Esses foram os 10 meses. Os 10 meses foram na Baxter.

Hannah: Oh, certo, ok.

Jeroen: It’s a pharma company.

Hannah: Do que você não gostou?

Jeroen: The corporate way of doing things, and the limited aspect of your job. The lack of feeling of responsibility and the way you cannot set the culture yourself — a combination of all these things, actually.

Hannah: Sim, isso dificulta a vida profissional.

Jeroen: Sim.

Hannah: Some people are really suited for that though. Aren’t they?

And I think we must be quite similar in that sense. I always knew I wanted to start a business. I don’t know why, I just did. I also would have struggled in a big corporate environment.

Jeroen: Sim.

Hannah: I guess every big company’s different, just like every small one is.

Jeroen: They’re different.

Actually, in the job after I was in an agency and I was doing projects for companies, but also sometimes onsite. I’ve worked with five companies and the differences are huge. In terms of how the culture can make you feel different, as a person even, is amazing. Just the way people treat you, the way people communicate, had a huge impact on my emotional life.

Hannah: Yeah, that’s not good.

Jeroen: De qualquer forma, parece que você tem interesses muito amplos. Então, você combinou todos esses estudos ou como isso funcionou?

Hannah: I don’t really know what happened. But while I was doing my first job at the software agency, I decided to take up a degree in my spare time.

I basically didn’t have a weekend or an evening for four years. I don’t know why I did that, but it was fun. So I actually did my degree in social science and economics.

Jeroen: Ah, tudo bem.

Hannah: But I really like economics. It’s funny, isn’t it?

Jeroen: Talvez o aspecto comercial?

Hannah: Yeah, or maybe all of it. I just really enjoyed that sort of thing. So I did that while I was working. I think I’d just finished my degree when I set up the first business.

Jeroen: Então você tem vários diplomas?

Hannah: Apenas um. Oh, meu Deus, n√£o estou mais estudando.

You learn so much as a founder, don’t you? You feel like you’re constantly learning and changing, and feeling like you don’t know what you’re doing. So you have to go away and just always be on top of that stuff.

For now, I wouldn’t undertake a formal qualification for a good while. Would you?

O que você estudou?

Jeroen: Na verdade, comecei como engenheiro eletr√īnico. Depois, no mestrado, engenharia biom√©dica. Depois disso, fiz faculdade de administra√ß√£o.

Hannah: Ok. Então, como você disse, ao entrar na engenharia e querer fazer isso desde muito cedo, acho que era óbvio abrir sua própria empresa?

Jeroen: Yeah, but then I figured I didn’t really want to be an engineer. I wanted to bring things to people. Engineering things, perhaps, but to people at least. That’s why I did business school, and then I figured I wanted to start my own company.

Achei que a melhor maneira de fazer isso seria ser gerente de produtos em uma empresa. Como estudei engenharia biomédica, pensei em uma empresa farmacêutica. E isso estava errado.

Hannah: Yeah, I guess. It’s a learning thing though, isn’t it? It might have felt wrong at the time, but like you said, you brought a lot of what was wrong with that to making things right and building a company out in a way that you’re happy with?

Jeroen: Exatamente. Você foi influenciado por sua família de alguma forma?

Hannah: I don’t know. My dad works at the university as director of facilities and estates, so he’s into property management. I don’t really understand what he does, but he does a lot. My mum was in nursing and became a receptionist, and my brother and sister both went down the medical route. Well, my sister’s a vet and my brother’s a doctor.

So I was the one who didn’t know what I wanted to do. I was the one just making it up.

Jeroen: It was not really your family, maybe your dad a bit. Or let’s just say, your friends?

Hannah: I honestly have no idea. It’s funny isn’t it?

I kind of feel like I fell into a lot of things, but figured things out by just getting there and trying stuff. I started to work on what I enjoyed doing and that helped. I’ve always loved computers since I got an Atari.

Você se lembra do Atari? Eu ganhei um Atari quando tinha seis anos.

Jeroen: Eu também tinha um Atari.

Hannah: Você tinha um? Sim.

Jeroen: Bem, meu pai tinha um. Mas, no final, ela ficou no meu quarto.

Hannah: Well, it would be rude not to play on it then if it’s there. Wouldn’t it?

Jeroen: Sim. Mesmo quando eu era muito pequeno, estava sempre sendo advertido sobre as coisas. Meu pai construía esses computadores que ainda começavam com um toca-fitas.

Hannah: Uau.

Jeroen: Sim.

Hannah: That’s really cool though.

Jeroen: So I’ve seen computers since I was really, really small.

Hannah: That’s brilliant. Yeah, I think it does help. Doesn’t it?

Having that sort of thing around. Like both my kids are really interested in computers too. We do Scratch, which is a really nice programming language for kids to learn, and we’ve got Raspberry Pi knocking about the house. So they both enjoy making things.

Mas nunca se sabe. Como eu disse, cresci sem pensar muito no que eu queria fazer.

Jeroen: Quantos anos eles já têm?

Hannah: They’re just about to turn eight and six.

Jeroen: As curvas 8 e 6 j√° est√£o programadas?

Hannah: Bem, apenas com o Scratch. Mas você aprende os fundamentos da computação criando pequenos jogos lá. Você já usou o Scratch?

Jeroen: N√£o, n√£o.

Hannah: It’s fun, it’s good for the basics.

Jeroen: Right. I don’t know what was the first thing I started on. I think hacking some scripts in game to cheat or something.

Hannah: Oh, meu Deus.

Jeroen: I don’t remember. At some point, I started doing HTML, Flash and stuff.

Hannah: Yeah, HTML is a good place to start. Isn’t it?

Jeroen: Yeah, it’s easy.

Hannah: Sim.

Jeroen: Você conhece outros fundadores de startups que, de alguma forma, admira, e por quê?

Hannah: That’s a good question. I think a lot of the time it isn’t the usual suspects, or the people with a big profile. I’ve always really enjoyed meeting other founders, and a lot of them fly underneath the radar.

I’ll give you some good examples. Matt Lanham at Gecko Labs for instance. That’s a brilliant SaaS company. He’s based in Scotland, is doing a lot of business over in the States though at the moment. He’s just really down to earth, and really easy to talk to. I think some people put up a bit of a front, and it’s nice to just get honest advice and he’s definitely one of those people.

Jeroen: Sem d√ļvida.

Hannah: And I look up to Kevin Beals, who’s the CEO at Refract. He builds this training software that SaaS teams use. It’s brilliant!

He was one of my angel investors actually. Again, he’s just so easy to talk to, really practical, really down to earth and he’s building a business just like we are. I think it’s more people like that, I guess.

E quanto a você? Você também tem uma rede estreita de pessoas ao seu redor com quem conversa?

Jeroen: Yeah. I like to talk to different people that I think are really doing a good job. It’s often inspiring.

Hannah: It helps, doesn’t it?

Jeroen: Yes, it does. Also, with these Founder Coffees, I get to talk to a lot of really cool people, and we also write about iconic products that have been made — like Trello, Slack, Intercom. They are really inspiring in the sense that these guys really maintain a vision in a very nice and consistent way, and build a product that’s just outstanding. That’s not as easy as it seems.

Hannah: Oh my gosh, yeah. It’s definitely not easy.

We were talking about Intercom yesterday, actually. We were one of the very first users of Intercom, so we’ve followed them all the way through. With the series D that was announced earlier in the week, it’s going to be really cool to watch where they go next. I’m excited to see what they do actually.

Jeroen: Yeah, I’m really wondering what they need all this money for. I can imagine somehow, but still I’m like, “Really? $125 million?”

Hannah: Yeah. You don’t know how much these press releases that go out around raises and stuff are true. A lot of them are nonsense, right? But I was reading that they were looking at getting into artificial intelligence. That’s a lot of money. So I guess, we’ll just have to see.

Jeroen: Yeah, we’ll see I guess. My guess is a lot of money will go into convincing the enterprises, pushing Zendesk out of the market, and Service Cloud or Salesforce.

Hannah: Yeah, they said that they want to be the next Salesforce or as big as that. So good luck to them I think, we’ll see what they do.

Jeroen: People have said that about us in the newspaper already. So it doesn’t mean anything.

Hannah: Uau. Bem, aí está!

Jeroen: Isso também aconteceu na Bélgica.

Hannah: V√° em frente! Por que n√£o?

Jeroen: Yeah, why not. Maybe at some point. For now, we’re taking a very different position from Salesforce. They’re going after the big enterprises, and we’re going after the small companies. It’s a totally different solution.

Hannah: Yeah, it’s a big difference I guess.

Jeroen: Quais s√£o suas ambi√ß√Ķes para o Receptive? Onde voc√™ v√™ o futuro?

Hannah: It’s just getting really exciting. We’re closing more and more enterprise SaaS customers. So, last year we had to learn a lot around legals and the onboarding of when you’ve got hundreds or thousands of employees, what that onboarding looks like, and what the customer’s success journey is like.

While we’re getting a lot of really good traction, it also feels like we’re just getting started, which is a really exciting position to be in, I guess. So I’d just like to keep going.

We’ve found a really nice rhythm. We’ve worked out how to sell and who to sell to, because you don’t know that stuff when you start out.

Jeroen: N√£o.

Hannah: It’s an evolution along the way, isn’t it? You’re learning all the time. So yeah, I just want to keep doing what I’m doing, and keep going, and keep developing the product and see what we can do.

Jeroen: Mas, a longo prazo, o que você está fazendo?

Hannah: Essa é uma boa pergunta.

Jeroen: Qual é realmente sua visão ou missão?

Hannah: Like I mentioned at the start, feedback is such a big opportunity and SaaS companies are just starting to get their heads around it. So it feels like they’re still at the stage where there’s a lot of early adopters going with Receptive and that’s why it is exciting for us.

But really, I think having a product feedback solution in place, should be so core to building a SaaS product that people should not have to think about it. In the same way as you need hosting and support. Product feedback is forgotten and it’s managed badly in a lot of ways, and our biggest competitor is the spreadsheet. So there’s a better way to do things, and I would like everyone using Receptive. But we’ll see.

Jeroen: Yeah. What are the things you’re working on lately?

Hannah: No produto ou de outra forma?

Jeroen: Não, em geral. O que você faz, na verdade?

Hannah: Isso muda todos os dias. Acabo fazendo todo tipo de coisa.

Jeroen: Sim.

Hannah: So quite recently I’ve been overseeing the GDPR stuff quite closely. Have you got everything that needs in place?

Jeroen: Yeah, actually after this call, I will continue on GDPR stuff. It’s one of our priorities right now, and it followed me. All the others get to do the fun stuff.

Hannah: Oh.

Jeroen: Sim, eu sei.

Hannah: That’s being a founder though, isn’t it? Everybody thinks you get to do what you want, and it’s actually, no, you get all the terrible jobs.

Jeroen: Yeah, but it’s a super interesting exercise as well. It’s not something that gives me tons of energy, but just organizing all this in a more thoughtful way, what in the end GDPR is about, is nice. I can see the positive aspects.

Hannah: Yeah. I think there’s a lot of positive things. Other people have been doing the hard work,but being involved in the lawyers and just overseeing the GDPR thing is on me. So there’s been a bit of that going on, and then apart from day to day, to talk broadly because things do change a lot, I’m mainly involved in overseeing the marketing and working closely with sales. There’s a lot of the co-marketing actually, a lot of the partnership type of things and events or speaking engagements.

But then I stay really close to customer success as well. I don’t ever want to lose sight of that. I still talk to customers a lot. I still will pick up the phone and will do a demo now and again, because I think it’s really important for me, right now, in terms of how we develop the company and how we develop the product to stay close to the people and the problems that we’re solving.

So it’s quite broad. I guess because of that, I have to be really careful about planning my time — making sure I’m working on the right things, making sure that there’s time to check in with the leaders of other departments. So yeah, it’s really good fun though. It’s nice doing all sorts of things. What does your role span?

Jeroen: It’s very similar to yours. I think we’re in very similar stages.

I’m currently doing lots of marketing and am very involved with the customer relationships as well. Currently, the GDPR stuff. I mean I also still manage the products, so it’s very similar to yours, I would say.

I’m not in a stage where I’m spending all my time hiring or something. We are still looking at how we can make a growth machine, instead of just adding extra people to what we have already nailed.

Hannah: I guess the job evolves all the time as well, doesn’t it? Depending on the stage you’re at, or, like we were saying, something like GDPR comes in and it’s so important to the business functioning side. It does need you to do a good job.

Mas o papel muda muito.

Jeroen: Sim. Eu estava mencionando coisas que me dão energia. O que é que lhe dá energia para continuar?

Hannah: Bem, h√° algumas coisas.

I think a big part of keeping the energy up and staying motivated, is you’ve got to enjoy what you’re doing. I really love the problem that we’re solving and the team, and that’s a massive motivating factor for me.

If I wasn’t as into the product and what we’re doing, then that would be hard after a while. The second big thing is just getting out. I go out biking quite a lot — bike to work and back, and I find if I’ve biked into work it really sets you up for the day, and then biking back home, gives me time to get into that home mode.

I think it can be tempting to ignore everything else, when you’re really busy. So trying to fit exercise or something into your routine can be really, really helpful.

Jeroen: Sim, qual √© a dist√Ęncia que voc√™ mora do trabalho?

Hannah: It’s not too far. It’s just 10 miles a day on the bike, but then I get on for longer.

Jeroen: Oh, that’s far. 10 miles is like 16 kilometers. That’s pretty far, if you ask me.

Hannah: It’s good fun though. It’s nice, and when you get in, you’re all hyper for the rest of the day. What about you, do you find time for that sort of a thing?

Jeroen: I started making time for that again. For a long time I abandoned these kind of things, but then your body starts disliking it. Right now, I’m trying to work home most of the days, and I’m into sports now. I used to run but I went to biking now.

Hannah: Ah, legal.

Jeroen: Sim, treinos realmente ativos. Observando a frequência cardíaca e outras coisas para garantir que eu faça algum exercício físico real. Acho que isso também proporciona muita energia mental.

Hannah: Yeah, it’s good thinking time, isn’t it?

I’ll set myself up. While I’m on the bike, going into work, I’ll think through what I’ve got on and what’s important that day. I think having no distractions like the computer or the phone, is really helpful.

Jeroen: Yeah, if you don’t start listening to podcasts, of course.

Hannah: Isso é perigoso, sim.

Jeroen: Então você está morando com seu marido e dois filhos?

Hannah: Yeah. He’s about the place as well, so it’s good having time with the family doing things nearby.

Jeroen: So is it basically like you work, you bike, and then you home and don’t work? Or how do you keep a balance?

Hannah: I tend to do a lot of reading in the evenings. I’ve got this weird thing, I can’t go to sleep unless I’ve read, I don’t know why. Since I was a child, I just have to read.

So I find it’s a good time for reading, and I do talk about work quite a lot at home as well. But apart from that, I do try to have that separation of, “I’m at home now.” When the kids are around, my phone’s in the top drawer and turned off and we’re just doing daft things, and I think that’s important as well. Like you mentioned the energy thing, having a good balance brings a lot of energy to your work. There’s no point being tired, is there?

If you get yourself exhausted, it’s very hard to recover from that.

Jeroen: Definitely. It’s always a danger, I guess. What does your husband do when you’re talking about work?

Hannah: Rolls his eyes! No, he doesn’t.

Jeroen: N√£o, quero dizer o que ele faz como trabalho.

Hannah: Ah. Então, ele trabalha com energia e sustentabilidade em uma grande empresa imobiliária. Ele faz todo tipo de coisa. Na verdade, ele trabalha muito na área de tecnologia, analisando as diferentes tecnologias que podem ser colocadas nos edifícios para torná-los eficientes em termos de energia.

Jeroen: Ah, legal.

Hannah: He was working on a project recently. He hooked a load of Raspberry Pis up to monitor a load of energy usage. So we talk about all those sort of things quite a bit. Sounds fun at our house, doesn’t house?

Jeroen: Sim. Na verdade, meu sogro faz a mesma coisa. Talvez devêssemos conectá-los.

Hannah: Oh that’s cool. We definitely should! Who does he work for?

Jeroen: He has his own company that does these kinds of installations and he really cares a lot about the sustainability side, so he’s always looking for ways to work on it. Even if the market is not super ready for it yet, he always finds a way to get it working here and there.

Hannah: That’s cool, because there’s a lot of stuff in that industry. A lot of the hardware and software; although it’s very early days for a lot of these technologies, and they’re moving on very quickly.

Jeroen: Yeah, and also people don’t get why they should get it. I mean it costs a lot of money.

Hannah: Yeah, that’s the other part of his job really, is making those cost arguments, and the ROI analysis, you know, “If we put these heat pumps in this building, it’s going to pay us back over X years, and in the long term the outcome is a saving of whatever.” So that’s the other side of it, and I think that’s kind of like what we do in a lot of ways.

Jeroen: Você acha que o momento é adequado para o Receptive neste momento ou as pessoas ainda estão se preparando para profissionalizar o gerenciamento de produtos?

Hannah: That’s another good question. We still feel like it’s early days market wise. There’s quite a few smaller companies popping up here and there, for feature request management, and customer feedback insights.

Portanto, acho que está começando a haver alguma tração, o que é realmente empolgante de se ver.

Jeroen: Yeah, that’s how I feel as well. We’re also currently looking to professionalize our stuff, and looking at solutions. We should maybe have another look at Receptive as well, it’s been a while.

Hannah: Oh, any time. But yeah, it’s an interesting one.

Jeroen: Você disse que morava em Londres?

Hannah: We’re actually up in Sheffield. So we’re a couple of hours north of London.

Jeroen: Em Sheffield?

Hannah: Yeah, which is pretty nuts, because most of our customers are in the States. I think we’ve got customers from about 35 countries now. We do make a real effort to get out and spend time with customers. We go over to America quite a bit.

Jeroen: Você voa muito por aí?

Hannah: Yeah, we do it between us. We’ve not been there yet this year, but we’re going to be over soon. I think that side of thing’s really important for us — to actually spend time with customers onsite. That’s one of the beautiful things about software, you can create something and you can be anywhere and you can still sell it all over the world, which is kind of cool.

Jeroen: Sim. Desde que você encontre boas pessoas em Sheffield para trabalhar, eu acho.

Hannah: Oh the team is brilliant. Really, really lucky there. There’s actually quite a lot of software and technology companies here, and a lot of creative industries too. So that’s cool.

Jeroen: H√° alguma universidade l√°?

Hannah: Yeah, there’s a couple of big universities as well. But it’s big technology companies based here as well — like WANdisco, SkyBet and others.

Jeroen: SkyBet, that’s the betting company?

Hannah: Yeah. I’m not a fan, but they work on some interesting scaling problems. I can’t say I like what they do.

Jeroen: Yeah, we have a similar thing. In Belgium we have, I’ve forgotten the name of the company. But it’s the company behind half of the porn industry.

Hannah: Oh, certo, meu Deus.

Jeroen: Sim.

Hannah: Então, aí está, uma pequena cidade na Bélgica e Sheffield.

Jeroen: Sim, esses lugares talvez sejam até mesmo a fronteira da tecnologia.

Hannah: Sim, pode-se dizer isso de v√°rias maneiras, sem d√ļvida.

Jeroen: Starting to wrap up, what’s the latest good book you’ve read, and why did you choose to read it?

Hannah: Oh, I’m a bit terrible with books because if I’m reading for work stuff it tends to be blog posts.

Jeroen: N√£o, n√£o necessariamente trabalho, apenas geral.

Hannah: Oh my gosh, I read anything. It’s a bit embarrassing, but I’m reading this really weird series about this lawyer based in London at the time of Henry VII at the moment. I honestly, read anything and everything. So I’ll have to think about which book.

O livro de negócios que li foi Play Bigger, que trata do design de categorias.

Jeroen: Sobre qual projeto?

Hannah: Design de categoria.

Jeroen: Certo.

Hannah: Yeah. So it’s about, you know, like I was saying about Receptive and where it is in terms of the market and if it’s too early, or whatever. Category design is about you owning the positioning and giving a name to what you do and that’s a really interesting book. I’ve taken a lot away from that one.

Jeroen: Yeah, because you’re basically building out a category.

Hannah: Sim, exatamente. Ent√£o, eu recomendo esse.

Jeroen: About me, I think I probably shared it on a few other talks as well already, maybe another one. The Black Swan was pretty good, up till some point. I don’t know whether you read it. It’s about how looking back, people look at history and they connect things. While when it actually happens, it wasn’t all that connected — just casually. Like the one thing that didn’t actually happen so logically, makes the other thing happen, because there are many factors. And when we look back, we start ignoring all these little factors here and there, which is a really interesting way of looking at things, because it makes you realize that you do that every day actually.

Not just looking at history, but that you look back and you connect things that make sense for your brain right now, but it didn’t actually happen because of that reason. It’s just you rationalizing things.

Hannah: Sim, o que é uma coisa natural.

Jeroen: Sim, com certeza.

Hannah: Faz com que você se sinta seguro e no controle, eu acho, se você fizer isso.

Jeroen: Exatamente. Mas quando você entende isso, ajuda de certa forma a não ter algum tipo de preconceito estranho e outras coisas.

Hannah: Vou dar uma olhada nisso, obrigada.

Jeroen: Sim. Mas fica um pouco repetitivo depois de 150/200 p√°ginas.

Hannah: You just summarize the rest of it then and I’ll read the first 150 pages.

Jeroen: Ah, o resto do livro entra em mais detalhes. Basicamente, fiz um resumo do livro.

Hannah: Perfeito. Vou seguir com isso.

Jeroen: Última pergunta. Se você tivesse que começar tudo de novo, o que teria feito de diferente?

Hannah: Eu teria procurado e encontrado Ali Mayham, que é nosso diretor de sucesso do cliente.

If I ever had to start a business again, it would be with Dan and Ali. So Dan’s my current Co-Founder, and Ali has become the third Founder. She came to work with us maybe when we were a year in. She has brought so much to this business from a customer success point of view.

So there’s no way, if I started over again, I would do it without having her there because it’s just bought the company so much.

Jeroen: Yeah, it’s all about the team for you.

Hannah: Yeah, oh my gosh. It is so all about the team. I’ve made a few wrong hires along the way, and that has a lot of impact — not just on you and the business, but on the team around you as well. You don’t realize often how someone’s who’s not a great fit has an impact on everyone around them as well. So yeah, that’s what I do differently. I’d get three co-founders and go from there.

Jeroen: Yeah, cool. Well, that’s all I got for our coffee session today! Thank you for being on Founder Coffee. It was really great to have you.

Hannah: I really enjoyed it. Did you finish your coffee? I think I’ve got a bit left that’s gone cold.

Jeroen: O meu j√° est√° pronto, sim.

Hannah: Oh, muito bem. Muito obrigada por me receber.

Jeroen: Thank you and I’ll see you soon!



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Jeroen Corthout